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Auto-firing game mecanic for vehicule while moving.
Let's make the vehicules more dynamic and mobile.
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WhoCares
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 7:40 am    Post subject: Auto-firing game mecanic for vehicule while moving. Reply with quote

I heard from quite some time that vehicules like tanks should get a buff to counter balance the infantry blob as the unique damage dealer.

I saw some idea like balancing stats or reducing build time on multiple war factories.

I Think a simple game mecanic can bring them back on the scene by using their mobility without altering their stats and as well put the game more fun playing with them.

Most of the Vehicule are with turret, they can aim and shoot at a target while moving only by doing a 2 steps action :

focus fire than move command
stop key (so they target the nearest enemy in range) than move command

The downsides of this;

  • First, it requires lot of micro because every time a target is dead or out of range you have to do the first step again (focus fire or stop).
  • Second and major dowside while you're doing the first step, your vehicle STOPS and will have hight risk to take damage or simply die by being immobile during the micro sec you need to give the move command.


My sugestion is allowing the vehicule to autotarget in move command according to their stance.

example by comparing :

current behaviour :
  • Tank is going A to B in move command : he will just travel ignoring everything until getting to B

  • Tank is going A to B in A-move command : he will travel but he will STOP and attack first enemy in range becoming an easy target and breaking his travel to be immobile until SURVIVING the engagement.


the behaviour of my idea :

  • Tank is going A to B in move command in hold fire stance ; tank will behave like the current behaviour, move A to B doing nothing.

  • Tank is going A to B in move command in defence stance : he will travel to B, firing at the first target in range without stoping or altering his journey, once the target is out of range (or dead) he would be cappable to adquire the next target in range and so until reaching B (without stopping one single time).

  • Tank is going A to B in move command in return fire stance : he will travel to B, will hold fire until receiving damage from a target in range without stoping or altering his journey, once the target is out of range he be able to respond to the next unit attacking him so until reaching B.

  • Tank is going A to B in A-move command : Same behaviour as the current one, the A-move has its use and don't need changes.

The idea is having vehicules that you can manouver by simple waypoints and be sure they will deal damage whatever happens and so without losing speed and be able to dodge some attack projectile.

practical examples :

  • A ranger sent around a blob with some queued waypoints in circle, he could dodge the rockets while automatiquely firing at all the units in range.

  • A squad of 4 tanks sent accros a base in a single move command, firing at all building one after another without stopping avoiding being hit by turret or flame tower while dealing damage.

  • 3 flak trucks sent around artie/V2 and be able to kill them just by being close without stoping at risk to be hit by a shell/V2 and without too much micro if nothing justify it.


This mechanic will also nerf the V2/artie play because you will just need to move close to them not even focus fire them (unless there is other unit in range that prevent your vehicule to auto target, you'll have to focuse fire).

I'm pretty sure this "simple" change would buff quite a lot each vehicule with turret and change a bit the way vehicule are currently used.

OFC, all vehicules without turret and forward attack would only be able to fire at an enemy if he is in the direct path without nescecity of turning to aim. example an apc sent across a blob to crush can fire right in front of him before crushing making prone the infantry and getting hight chance to crush or at least inflict damage if the crush doesn't happen.

For the ones who would like to respond with an argument like "yeah but micro needs skill, bla bla bla" Sure it does, but by adding this automatic behaviour you don't have to micro on a single unit like crazy to acheive a minor goal, you can micro more units at once and start thinking complicated coregraphy of several vehicule squads at once with complicated queue of order and trying to acheive the perfect timing that will give you the triumph. Wich is impossible right now. So,plz don't think "you're trying to make this too easy" but see "I'm trying to open more gameplay opportunity".

Thank you for your patience to read the whole thing and feel free to ask questions if some points are unclear.

WhoCares
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AoAGeneral1
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 7:49 am  Reply with quote

The problem with this is it buffs light tanks way to much. Rangers and medium tanks would receive some buffs in the wrong ways in dealing with heavy tanks and mammoth tanks itself as well. (This isn't considering that flak traks will also be able to do the same as well without needing to do micro movement attacks.)
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WhoCares
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 2:51 pm  Reply with quote

AoAGeneral1 wrote (View Post):
The problem with this is it buffs light tanks way to much. Rangers and medium tanks would receive some buffs in the wrong ways in dealing with heavy tanks and mammoth tanks itself as well. (This isn't considering that flak traks will also be able to do the same as well without needing to do micro movement attacks.)


I diden't considere interaction between the different class of tanks themself, that's a very good point. I still would like playtest it and to see in the overhaul if "that" would be the only "problem" and if the rest of what the new baheviour brings is worth trying to "fix" "that".

Next question then : Is it possible to mod of add in a map to playtest and see if it is as cool as i think ? ( My fear is that would be a core modification only doable by the devs themselve so no playtest until them would approve the idea and make playtest out of it)
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 3:31 pm  Reply with quote

Not a bad idea. Does seem like it needs a lot of work though
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:23 pm  Reply with quote

hey WhoCares, I and others spoke to you on the Forum a bit and wanted to confirm what was discussed:

  • The change would be on the engine side, it cannot be scripted/traited in.
  • If a unit has a turret and would attack if it was stationary in the same position then it should attack when moving through that position.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:29 pm  Reply with quote

WhoCares wrote (View Post):
Next question then : Is it possible to mod of add in a map to playtest and see if it is as cool as i think ? ( My fear is that would be a core modification only doable by the devs themselve so no playtest until them would approve the idea and make playtest out of it)


Sorry, I don't think this is possible without changing the code of AttackTurreted (and it's activities).
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:58 pm  Reply with quote

Simple a-moving a blob consisting of infantry and tanks will split it at the first sight of enemy as infantry will stop to fire and tanks will not. Looks like quite an explosive change.
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WhoCares
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 5:24 pm  Reply with quote

netnazgul wrote (View Post):
Simple a-moving a blob consisting of infantry and tanks will split it at the first sight of enemy as infantry will stop to fire and tanks will not. Looks like quite an explosive change.


No, amove stays like it is, it has it own puprose and there is no point to change it.

i
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 4:10 pm  Reply with quote

excellent idea, and tanks should be more keen to attacking other vehicles and almost avoid infantry completely unless only target left in sight.

I also think rifle infantry should almost only attack other infantry unless the only target in sight is something else.


Thank would make the battles much more "smart" and fluid instead of battling micro manage APM errors
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2017 12:47 am  Reply with quote

It would also make tanks much more useless since they will stop tanking damage for infantry. I also thought that a change like this may be cool, but if it would work, you'd need to combine it with tanks acting like some kind of a mobile wall, taking shots for the infantry. Otherwise, you just made tanks mostly useless.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2017 1:55 am  Reply with quote

lucassss wrote (View Post):
It would also make tanks much more useless since they will stop tanking damage for infantry. I also thought that a change like this may be cool, but if it would work, you'd need to combine it with tanks acting like some kind of a mobile wall, taking shots for the infantry. Otherwise, you just made tanks mostly useless.


That let you the opportunity to use the tank in another way than just tanking for your infantry, but that part still works. We just had here an way to use the vehicules on their own without the slow infantry.

After, the way you use of your vehicule is your own bizness ^^
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